OK rebuilding

[countykid]

Can we do this?

Oklahoma Resurgence

 

[pita141]

You mean win Junior Nationals in Fargo, or make a cool inspirational video and post it on Flo?

I'm sure we could get one of those accomplished in no time, making a cool video though might take a really great group of kids, and a lot of work and dedication for a couple of years to get to that level. Maybe we could have one ready by the 2024 season or so.

 

[countykid]

I guess you're more of a "look at the pictures" kind of person instead of actually reading the words to understand and learn the message... Right on. It takes all kinds.

 

[darth vomitus]

No. Not enough "solid" coaching, and SC puts more emphasis on Disney Duals then preparing for freestyle/Greco.

Oklahoma High School wrestling has fallen way off from where they were at in the 80's and 90's - you can read the OK State message board to get opinions on why. That said, they are showing signs of a "resurgence" as they won the National Duals (freestyle), and have some outstanding kids going to Fargo. Why they can do it and we can't:

1) More and better coaching at the high school level on down.
2) Independent clubs to allow for better off-season training.
3) They begin preparing immediately after season for freestyle and Greco.
4) Well organized state chapter of USA Wrestling that selects team (based on competition) and supports team.
5) More/better college programs.

I doubt we will ever get our coaching to the level of other states as the sport is still considered an "also-ran" at most programs. That we keep pushing our best kids to go to Disney instead of preparing for Fargo is beyond me.

 

[countykid]

1) More and better coaching at the high school level on down. This is your opinion but you may validate it by taking a poll as to how many head coaches are really football coaches that the AD "asks" to coach the wrestling team. If there were more importance placed on WR would this change?

2) Independent clubs to allow for better off-season training. These are growing every year AND HS coaches are offering them as well. If there were more importance placed on WR would this change?

3) They begin preparing immediately after season for freestyle and Greco. I know for a fact that several, including ours, started right after regular season, with a FS GR tournament 2 weeks after. If there were more importance placed on WR would this change?

4) Well organized state chapter of USA Wrestling that selects team (based on competition) and supports team. Our USAW leadership did as good a job as any state to organize an off season schedule AND duals teams for schoolboy, cadet and junior. If more coaches and parents would get involved and support this, it would grow.

5) More/better college programs. With the population of our state being a little small and our enrollment of HS WR one of the smallest in the country, we have more colleges offering WR than some states that have a higher enrollement and are competing at a higher level nationally. Like GA, AL, & FL. Newberry (top 10 ranked most years), Limestone, Coker, Anderson, Citadel, SMC and club teams at Clemson and USC.

If we want WR to grow in this state, it needs to start at the grass roots and middle school levels. How can we market and promote the sport better should be the question we ask.

oh and PA did not send a team to the national duals and I don't think fargo either. But the did send 14 teams to Disney.

 

[Lower Deck Tiger]

More Organized MIddle School wrestling programs would be a great start. Other districts should learn from Spartanburg County where the schools have organized teams w paid coaches!

 

[darth vomitus]

I have been a dedicated subscriber to "Amateur Wrestling News" since the late '80's. It is my favorite wrestling publication. In the last two issues Bob Preusse, the "High School Insider" columnist and Ironman tournament runner, has asked several prominent high school coaches and a DI coach what makes hs wrestlers successfully transition to college and how important are the international styles and Fargo. I encourage anyone reading this post to check his two latest columns out.

Several years ago Brian Wolfe won two 4A titles for White Knoll beginning his junior year. Prior to that he was a relative unknown as he had not yet qualified for the state tournament. If you were to ask Brian or his father, who trained him during the off-season, what the biggest single reason for him going from a non-qualifier to champ in a year should be credited to, they would tell you that it was the number of freestyle matches Brian wrestled after his sophomore season.

A couple of years ago I had the privilege of housing a current DI coach, and very accomplished competitor, for a month while he was between coaching jobs. Every single day I harassed him with all manner of questions concerning wrestling - that was his rent lol. One of the many things I learned from him was how important Fargo was to DI recruiting. Just about every coach goes there. They want to see which kids are year-round dedicated, how they do against nationally ranked kids, and how they handle themselves after wins AND losses.

Countykid:

1) Not sure what you are saying as it seems you are validating the point for me. I won't share my opinion about the majority of coaches in SC whether well-intentioned or just looking for an extra supplement.
2) Not talking about hs clubs. In the video the majority of training is done at Hardell Moore's for profit club. HS coaches work long hours and sacrifice a lot during season. They want to spend time with family afterwards; not train full bore. The only independent club I am aware of is in Charleston.
3) Not talking about a few kids. I'm talking about SC's best. That's the only way we make an impression - a Jordan Wigger at every weight.
4) I really can't comment on current goings-on in SCUSA Wrestling, but I believe other states have a qualifier(s) to choose the team and then raise money for the trip. I think that would be a better use of funds than sending officials on junkets.
5) I did not clarify here - I meant DI programs. Big fan of what Coach Valek has done at Newberry, but I'm talking about DI as we all know that is the "pro" league for our sport. And if you think Clemson and USC should figure in this conversation you should think again. Trust me on that.

PA doesn't have to worry about sending kids to Fargo if they don't want. Their wrestlers are known. SC wrestlers are unknown and not "respected" by the "wrestling states." Almost every coach makes a yearly pilgrimage to Fargo - Disney not so much. But hey, don't take my word for it. Brian Dolph has an interview on Flo where he discusses why Fargo is more important than Disney.

I am far and away a bigger supporter of folkstyle as I believe it is the closest style to "true" wrestling, but I have long known how important the international styles are to recruiting/rankings and in the last decade have grown to appreciate how these styles can help better develop folkstyle wrestlers. Your original question, in regards to the Flo video entitled "Oklahoma Resurgence" was, "Can we do this?" No, you have to have a "surgence" to then, after some down years, have a "resurgence."

Unfortunately, SC is an afterthought in the world of wrestling. There are a great deal of areas we can improve on (some mentioned in my initial post) but most are difficult if not unlikely to happen. One area we do have the power to make a change over the next several years is to get our best to train in freestyle/greco, go to Fargo and National Duals, and be competitive. Not easy, but with work doable.

 

[HasBeen125]

I have seen just a few coaches in the state that are only there for the money. I am a (vol) coach and the head coach has never wrestled a day in his life but he is a wizard at getting the guys out for wrestling in a very small school. He has actually learned alot about wrestling in the last few years to the point that im not needed. Our team is always very competitive and has been one of the top 5 teams the last several years. He has built the program while all i have done is teach the students how to wrestle beyond the basics. I don't believe coaches are the problem.
In the south football is the ruler over all and that will never change here even though wrestling has been gaining a small amount of ground.No one tunes in on sun and mon night to watch wrestling. I sure wish they did. So until football, basketball and baseball stop paying millions or wrestling starts to pay millions this will not change in the south.

 

[darth vomitus]

Was watching this interview for other reasons (GO HAWKS!!!!), but his comments starting shortly after the 7:00 mark are pertinent to my comments from this discussion:

http://badgerstatewrestling.com/index.php?option=com_php&Itemid=49&tid=427