Are there any school districts in SC (or any other state) that employee at district wide AD while still employing school based ADs? If so, what is the main purpose of this?
District Wide AD
- Thread starter NewGamecock_07
- Start date
Buddy system. Creating a high paying, albeit unnecessary position. Some of the really large districts have 'em & they're totally useless.
I can tell you we looked at the possibility in Anderson District 5(TLH & Westside) but felt it would not be cost effective
We just hired AD's at both schools but they are also V Principals and handle discipline and other issues so we made the AD
a dual role. The main purpose is the AD but they also have a lot of other duties as well and both HC of Football at both schools are
asst AD's
There are approx 40 sports at each school and we felt it would be hard for one person to handle all the AD duties, and trust me there is a LOT to do
with all the record keeping and reporting that is required
We just hired AD's at both schools but they are also V Principals and handle discipline and other issues so we made the AD
a dual role. The main purpose is the AD but they also have a lot of other duties as well and both HC of Football at both schools are
asst AD's
There are approx 40 sports at each school and we felt it would be hard for one person to handle all the AD duties, and trust me there is a LOT to do
with all the record keeping and reporting that is required
I like the idea of making them Assistant (vice) Principals and AD. How does this work though? Does the coach also have to be secondary admin certified? If this is the case, it can narrow down the applicant pool.
Yes NewGamecock7, they have to have an Admin Certificate from what I understand
The HC at TLH and Westside are NOT the AD's but they are Asst AD's.
The AD/Asst Principal seems to be working real well since most anyone in that job (at least the 2 we hired) is a former coach and most
all of your coaches make great disciplinarians and have leadership ability . Takes a lot of stress off the Principal
We did look at ONE AD for the District but were too worried there were too many sports for one person to handle and handle well and we really needed some help at both high schools in the discipline department
So far it seems to be working very well
Also another concern is that when your have 2 high schools in a District we were worried that one may get more "attention" than the other or at least be perceived that way
I have seen first hand what the AD's have to deal with and trust me there is a LOT OF CRAP that they have to deal with and reporting on ALL sports
The HC at TLH and Westside are NOT the AD's but they are Asst AD's.
The AD/Asst Principal seems to be working real well since most anyone in that job (at least the 2 we hired) is a former coach and most
all of your coaches make great disciplinarians and have leadership ability . Takes a lot of stress off the Principal
We did look at ONE AD for the District but were too worried there were too many sports for one person to handle and handle well and we really needed some help at both high schools in the discipline department
So far it seems to be working very well
Also another concern is that when your have 2 high schools in a District we were worried that one may get more "attention" than the other or at least be perceived that way
I have seen first hand what the AD's have to deal with and trust me there is a LOT OF CRAP that they have to deal with and reporting on ALL sports
jhawk, it was announced at the AD meetings this week, so it is more than just a rumor this time. Personally I would like to see it broken down to two "less powerful" positions. Maybe a Fall / Spring situation or HS / MS thing. Too many schools & teams for one person to do a good job.
Lefty, I understand what you are saying but that would NOT BE COST EFFECTIVE
Trust me when I say this, you have no clue how tight budgets are at schools. Trust me on this, I see if first hand in Anderson 5 and had no clue until I became a Board of Trustee member
More multi tasking at high school level when it comes to sports than in a small business and keep in mind you have to keep costs as low as possible for athletics like it or not
Trust me when I say this, you have no clue how tight budgets are at schools. Trust me on this, I see if first hand in Anderson 5 and had no clue until I became a Board of Trustee member
More multi tasking at high school level when it comes to sports than in a small business and keep in mind you have to keep costs as low as possible for athletics like it or not
tprice, I think I might have a better clue on the Greenville County situation than you think. It could be cost effective, but it would not satisfy those that like the "power" thing. Money is not the biggest issue with our board / district office.
RE: "Trust me when I say this, you have no clue how tight budgets are at schools. Trust me on this, I see if first hand in Anderson 5 and had no clue until I became a Board of Trustee member"
"I have no clue how Greenville County operates at all, I am just speaking on Anderson 5"
So now, you have no clue how Greenville County does it. Which is it? Sorry and I don't mean to start anything, but why make a comment as an expert, when you are only going to come back and say you have no clue? I'm pretty familiar with the way the district runs, the money situation and general operations. I do have a clue and this situation could be done, but won't because of the control or power aspect. The district isn't too big from an academic standpoint. It is definitely too big from an athletic and arts standpoint. But at this point the one thing that would change the athletic part would be more students in less schools, AND no one is going to close schools.
"I have no clue how Greenville County operates at all, I am just speaking on Anderson 5"
So now, you have no clue how Greenville County does it. Which is it? Sorry and I don't mean to start anything, but why make a comment as an expert, when you are only going to come back and say you have no clue? I'm pretty familiar with the way the district runs, the money situation and general operations. I do have a clue and this situation could be done, but won't because of the control or power aspect. The district isn't too big from an academic standpoint. It is definitely too big from an athletic and arts standpoint. But at this point the one thing that would change the athletic part would be more students in less schools, AND no one is going to close schools.
Not arguing I just gave my opinion on how we approached it in Anderson 5, the District Wide AD has come up at meetings but with 2 HS's we found the AD/Asst Principal fits us very well
As for GCS system, I can see where something that large needs a District Wide AD. To me it would be more of an Asst Superintendent over Athletics . With that many sports teams/coaches/players somebody at the District level would need to be in charge of it all
I honestly have no clue how GCS operates and how their chain of command is set up
I am not proposing they close any schools, that would be an idiotic statement on my part since I have no background info and nobody is going to close new schools
Not sure what your beef is, never said I was an "expert" but I can assure you from Anderson 5 standpoint I know it inside/out .
As for GCS system, I can see where something that large needs a District Wide AD. To me it would be more of an Asst Superintendent over Athletics . With that many sports teams/coaches/players somebody at the District level would need to be in charge of it all
I honestly have no clue how GCS operates and how their chain of command is set up
I am not proposing they close any schools, that would be an idiotic statement on my part since I have no background info and nobody is going to close new schools
Not sure what your beef is, never said I was an "expert" but I can assure you from Anderson 5 standpoint I know it inside/out .
tprice, my beef comes from someone in a district with 2(?) high schools tells me that I have no clue how our district (18 high schools) is run without that person having a clue how our district runs or who I am. By no stretch am I anyone of importance, but I have been in this district for 15 years and I do know how it operates. While I don't always or even often agree with the policies and politics of the district, I do commend them for remembering the first purpose of a school district is to educate young people. I think the track record of the GCSD stacks up pretty well against most other districts within the southeast in that arena.
As far as athletics, there are less things within the district that I agree with than I disagree with, but again, I am not in charge or a person of any power. I do understand the feeling that by having more schools and teams that more students will have the opportunity to participate, but results suffer. In my humble opinion, winning teaches life lessons also and I think that part is being overlooked by some at the district office. I think that schools should have positions available for head coaches to hire qualified staff without having to look for an English or Science teacher that wants to help. I also think that head coaches should be allowed to teach heavier loads the opposite semester of their sport with light loads during their season. I also think that if a teacher gets a position based on the thought that they will coach a certain sport and then decides not to coach, their position should become available for another person to come in that actually wants to coach. Most of all, I think that coaches should actually know something about the sport they coach and care about teaching the students that sport.
End of rant.
As far as athletics, there are less things within the district that I agree with than I disagree with, but again, I am not in charge or a person of any power. I do understand the feeling that by having more schools and teams that more students will have the opportunity to participate, but results suffer. In my humble opinion, winning teaches life lessons also and I think that part is being overlooked by some at the district office. I think that schools should have positions available for head coaches to hire qualified staff without having to look for an English or Science teacher that wants to help. I also think that head coaches should be allowed to teach heavier loads the opposite semester of their sport with light loads during their season. I also think that if a teacher gets a position based on the thought that they will coach a certain sport and then decides not to coach, their position should become available for another person to come in that actually wants to coach. Most of all, I think that coaches should actually know something about the sport they coach and care about teaching the students that sport.
End of rant.
Lefty, the last paragraph of your post I agree with 100%.
I have seen that as well over the years where someone takes a teaching/coaching position and then after a couple of years decides they do not want to coach anymore. However if they are a science teacher those (and Math) are hard to come by. I do think what happens to a lot of folks that get into coaching is that at some point they decide to go into Admin jobs and this prevents them from continuing to coach. In all honesty if you are not going to be a HC at some time most men/women with a coaching back ground generally make very good Administrators and the money so much better in the Admin side as opposed to remaining a classroom teacher/coach over their career plus it really bumps up their retirement as well
Again not knocking GCS I just referred to Anderson 5 since that is what I am knowledgeable about
I have seen that as well over the years where someone takes a teaching/coaching position and then after a couple of years decides they do not want to coach anymore. However if they are a science teacher those (and Math) are hard to come by. I do think what happens to a lot of folks that get into coaching is that at some point they decide to go into Admin jobs and this prevents them from continuing to coach. In all honesty if you are not going to be a HC at some time most men/women with a coaching back ground generally make very good Administrators and the money so much better in the Admin side as opposed to remaining a classroom teacher/coach over their career plus it really bumps up their retirement as well
Again not knocking GCS I just referred to Anderson 5 since that is what I am knowledgeable about
Hiring can be difficult for a number of reasons. Those not in the building sometimes I think believe that when jobs come open that every qualified tom dick and harry come out of the wood work and submit their resumes and somehow there is this conspiracy to deny them a job that people on message boards claim they deserve.
And not to be asinine but teachers are not hired to coach. Any school that hires a teacher based on coaching first and teaching second would not be my child's school whether they were a gifted athlete or not.
And not to be asinine but teachers are not hired to coach. Any school that hires a teacher based on coaching first and teaching second would not be my child's school whether they were a gifted athlete or not.
buckeye, between physical ed, driver's ed, weight lifting, keyboarding and other non stringent academic classes, there are plenty of opportunities for coaches to do a great job in the classroom. Add to that group the number of volunteer coaches that schools have access to, and the overall coaching staff for each team should be pretty decent. I am not suggesting that coaching should be the first choice in hiring teachers. What I am saying is that the person that says "yes, I will coach basketball" just to get the teaching job and then says "I changed my mind and don't want to coach" 3 months later, should be shown the door. And yes, there is more of that happening in athletics, arts, etc. than many folks realize.
One thing the Hillcrest win might have done is to wake some folks up in Greenville County. We have discussed it to death on here, and I think some coaches, and administrators, and lots of supporters, just fell back on the excuse that it couldn't be done in Greenville County. Became satisfied just to ease into a playoff appearance every now and then and call it a successful season. And historically, Hillcrest has been as mediocre, or worse, than anyone else in the county. But they have shown that it can be done. Hopefully this will wake up some administrators, ADs, and fan bases to the fact that maybe you don't have to settle for less just because there is another school five miles down thebroad.
Amazing what Hillcrest did when they rid themselves of the Good Ole Boy Chammnis.
Now- as far as needing a district AD- NO- it is a waste.
In Anderson 5 they waste money because the 2 FB coaches teach NO classes and make $90,000. Oh, there name is on 2 classes but they NEVER darken the door! So ALL districts WASTE money.
Now- as far as needing a district AD- NO- it is a waste.
In Anderson 5 they waste money because the 2 FB coaches teach NO classes and make $90,000. Oh, there name is on 2 classes but they NEVER darken the door! So ALL districts WASTE money.
Love these districts that talk about budgets but have no problems going out and hiring superintendents, district admins, AD's, and Head Football Coaches and giving them outlandish salaries while teachers have no supplies, have frozen salary scales, and support staff people make minimum wage to deal with BS.
I think it has a lot to do with Institutional Control. I think Superintendents feel like that have lots of control over personnel, budgeting and academia... but in the realm of athletics, they are often feel left out the loop. Prinicpals uaully work very closely with their AD, especially as more and more schools make the AD an Admin position with Discipline processing and other responsiblilities.
The Super can create a position that your school level ADs have to answer to, therefor giving him a direct line to their daily, weekly or yearly decisions. It also affords the district the C.Y.A. solution if there is a problem with eligibilty or monies spent.
If the district is thriving and economically can afford it, I see no reason that it can't be used effectively. Although, I will admit, it's not a position that should be high on any district's wishlist in today's economy.
The Super can create a position that your school level ADs have to answer to, therefor giving him a direct line to their daily, weekly or yearly decisions. It also affords the district the C.Y.A. solution if there is a problem with eligibilty or monies spent.
If the district is thriving and economically can afford it, I see no reason that it can't be used effectively. Although, I will admit, it's not a position that should be high on any district's wishlist in today's economy.
I think that one of the issues that most of us have is that we are looking at it from a standpoint of actual athletics and the quality of coaching and play. The district is not looking at it in that way. They are looking at it as more of a cost effective form of liability reduction. By having an additional layer between the general public, coaches, school administrators and the board, it protects the district in general. The overall AD is not only in charge of athletics, they are also in the role of making sure that ALL communications / policies are handled in the same way. In other words, it keeps someone in a higher position from saying something stupid or making a decision that is not consistent with other decisions and getting the district in trouble. The position can and probably does pay for itself through reduced insurance and liability costs.
While we are talking in the realm of administrative moves, I have a question. Does Greenville County still require all athletes to buy that worthless insurance policy to play sports. Been a few years since either of my kids were in high school, but I know we had to buy it. Both of them got hurt. One in football, and one in competitive cheer. At that time I tried to file a claim on it, and was basically told that it didn't kick in under our circumstances because we had private insurance. I always figured someone at Camperdown Way was getting a nice little kick back on that scam.
midline, yes they still have to have that 100% worthless, not worth a dime insurance. What is really sad is that most travel organizations use the same company and they do offer some really good insurance at a lot less cost. For example, a travel baseball / softball team can cover up to 20 players on their roster with a $250 deductible for less than $12 per player for a year. The school district charges $36 or 38 for middle school and over $50 for high school players. It is absolutely ridiculous.
Amazing. And I knew quite a few others that wondered the same thing. By being mandatory, one assumes that anything that happens to them during practice or games would be covered. My son had major knee surgery and the worthless insurance didn't even cover the deductible. It paid absolutely nothing. When I talked with the AD about it, he sort of sheepishly told me that I would get nothing out of it. When I then asked him why such a farce would be pushed on the kids, of course he blamed the district. Of course, the districh just blamed the insurance company, which had a million reasons as to why they were not liable. Maybe a district wide AD could at least provide some decent insurance for those that don't have private coverage, or let it go altogether.
Richland County School District One (Dreher, Flora, LR, Keenan, Eau Claire, Columbia, CA Johnson) has a District Athletics Director and each school has an AD who is not a coach.
midline, I would be willing to bet that if you had no other insurance, the coverage would have been pretty good. It's when you have primary insurance and the athletic policy is secondary that it stinks. The biggest problem from a district standpoint would be if a parent did not have insurance and a student was injured. The parents would sue if there were no athletic insurance in place.