To open up a can of worms, you know what alleviates the judgement call on playing the edge?
Push-outs.
A change in venue?
- Thread starter SprawlANDStall
- Start date
To open up a can of worms, you know what alleviates the judgement call on playing the edge?
Push-outs.
Push-outs are the hardest to judge, college or HS. Please bring the college rule to HS, but not the freestyle rule of a point for going out.
I'm sure all of these officials get together and discuss the rules. They decide what's considered stalling, etc....Why can't they put a "push-out" rule in there?
Or do they just have meetings on what they can consider a "judgement call"?
Agree to disagree there. I think we see a push-out/step out rule in college in the next decade.
Our meetings and discussions are centered around the rule book and interpretations of the rules. We can't just "put" a rule in the book. The NFHS writes the rule book each year. You might see the college rule come to HS but doubt you will see a point for a push out come into play.
Freestyle push-outs aren't judgement calls. They are pretty cut and dry. I say the gray area in what is stalling and what is not, as a 1 to 1 comparison, is measurably larger.
To clarify, I don't think push-outs solve any of the above officials issues but with regards to guys making camp on the boundary, as was the above issue, it certainly would.
To clarify, I don't think push-outs solve any of the above officials issues but with regards to guys making camp on the boundary, as was the above issue, it certainly would.
That's what makes wrestlers wrestle in freestyle and Greco is the fact if they get pushed out, the other wrestler gets a point. That's how it should be. The wrestlers backing up and out of the circle should lose a point (or a point awarded to the other wrestler).
It's not any different than a wrestler using a russian to set up a move and the other wrestler backing out to escape the russian.
Essentially, we have that now for a stall call. I'm guessing you think that the rule will change to a full point?
Oh of course, I'm thinking with regards to the sport as a whole. Not that SC should be out here implementing experimental rules.
I do think we'll see the college out of bounds trickle down soon. As it should have already. Hopefully, like, really soon.
What I'm saying is, projecting out 10-15 years, I think we see a trending of our national scholastic rules towards that of international competition push-outs and the elimination of riding time at the college level being the easiest.
So when you say interpretations, you're basically pinning ideas to what you can consider a judgement call? I would think that a rule is pretty clear. I didn't know that a rule could be interpreted in many different ways.
That is what I'm saying. An elimination of language like "backing straight out" or "attempting to stay in" which is still judgement based, would be eliminated. You step out, you give up a point.
That said, the backing out of bounds for a stall has been great to watch over the several seasons at the college level. It does create that action in the center.
The call we had in the 5A 126 finals is a perfect example. The rule book states in a peterson situation, the top man "must be concerned about being pinned before a reversal can be awarded". Well, what is concerned? We interpret concerned as being in near fall criteria. And, when I say we, I mean a majority of states nationwide.
Many rules are cut and dry, like how many points for a TD, where and when a coach can leave the bench, etc.. Others, like the one mentioned above, need some discussion. I am sure we would welcome you to any and all of our meetings to help you better understand the process.
Perfectly stated. It does create that action in the center. You would think that an official could make that happen. Actually an official could if they would enforce a more strict stalling call and actually all do it the same or just actually do it.
Totally agree with you!! The majority of my matches in college the wrestlers never go out of bounds in neutral. We are encouraged to make a stall call in that situation unless there is a shot situation occurring. The kids are smart, they stay in bounds. I love the rule! The less judgement in the rules for officials, the better!!
Absolutely. It's a noticeable difference in the wrestling action. You'll see kids know the situation and just give the warning up late but then fight like hell 15 seconds later to stay center.
That rule, along with the quick count on top when dropping to a leg and the quick count on that lame side headlock ride has quickened the pace of action
All great rule changes and would love to see all three come down to HS. The smart wrestlers will also take a drop down stall call late to stay on top and keep getting riding time if they don't have a stall call yet.
Why would concerned not be when the kid post his arm out to keep from going to his back? Or when the kid sits up off of his back? Both of these happened in that match as well. I would say that if I am put to my back and I post up on my arm, I am "concerned" because if I did not post or sit up then I am going to be pinned.
I hate it when the bottom wrestler stands up and runs out of bounds and the top guy gets hit for push out, or fleeing the mat, 1 point penalty. Its obvious who is doing the running. If the top guys hips are close to the bottom guys, the bottom guy is running. If the top guys hips are away and his should is in the back, he is pushing them out not to give up the escape. I wish I could draw a picture of it. I about lost my crap at State because of that. oh well. Work on that fellas.
Funny thing is that coaches/fans will accept the wrong call if it's in his favor and not complain one bit. I see a lot wrong with complaining on this board about officials when it's against you but when the same call goes your way you act like all is great in the world! The three biggest complainers about every call that is a judgement call are the FM, RH, and BS coaches and fans. in that order! Even when they know it's the right call they try to run to the table to complain. Sit down and hush if you know it's the right call! You kill the flow of the matches and I don't blame refs for acting like assholes when you complain about every call! Same coaches try to intimidate the new refs too. I thought bullies were frowned upon!